WWYD- Farrier Disagrees with Vet's Rx

From the Everyday shoeing thread, farriers have a limit (or not) to what a vet wants done if farrier feels that it is harmful to the horse. How do owners see this?

I would hope that farrier and vet could communicate with eachother or both be present.
Would a farrier even try to contact the vet for a discussion?
Who is the owner most likely to side with?
What would an owner think if their farrier is refusing to do what the vet requests because it's harmful?
How many owners would continue to insist on doing what the vet wants?

How many farriers would refuse to do what the vet wanted if the vet wanted, for example, the hoof shod medially 1/2 inch higher on the fronts to correct a 10 year old horse's crooked legs, or toeing out?

Thanks, George. I can't recall my vets ever insisting, and most of the time the farrier and vet in the area had worked together before.

I wonder how many farriers here have a story to tell about how they walked away from an insistent vet rx'ing the wrong thing?

I have at times gone with the Vets solution while proposing my solution as a back up. I try and keep an open mind. There is so much we do not know about what works and why. Also everthing is going to work sometimes. A lot of times the Vets solution that I would not have gone with works and I learn from the experience. If on the other hand it does not suit the needs of that particular horse I have prepared the way to try my solution in a few weeks when we reshoe the horse and then the Vet learns from my choice. Or sometimes NEITHER works and the vet farrier team scratches our heads brainstorms and generally solve the problem the third time. Much better protocol than a pissing contest.

I'm really lucky to have a good relations with ALL vets in my operating area. They are all happy to communicate and willing to listen if you have something to offer that they may not of heard of before.

However, I personally write on every invoice for corrective shoeing "as per veterinary instruction" after what has been applied which covers your back along with any email correspondance which is the way I see all radiographs now they are digital.

I have noticed this as well.

Generally when I meet face to face with a vet and discuss the horse in hand things go very well.

It is the vets who insist on passing messages to the farrier through the owner, refuse to return telephone calls to discuss treatment options, and refuse to meet in person to discuss the horse in hand . . . then show up as a guest lecturer at the International Hoof Care Summit talking about the importance of vet/farrier communication.

I know about 6 or 7 farriers that have walked away from this situation with one vet in particular. It's cool though they all got the exact same prescription passed to them through different owners with different horses - it's a standard hand-out. Kind of a running joke in the area.

My apologies Tom. I didn't realize you had to deal with that particular POS. Now I understand your frustration with this situation. Disregard my comments but you should also include an asterisk with your comments for further clarification

Probably not thinking of the same person. But I've dealt with that one too, LOL!

It would depend on if the vet had read the study "Wedging" ; Olin Blach 1994{?}. Thus, educate one's self so one can defend one's viewpoint.

Oh come on now George, everyone loves to hear barn politic stories! I can't see that as being way off topic!

Mr. Perry, I just threw the medial scenario out there , couldn't think of anything better. Surely someone has a better scenario.

It's not a hyperbole senario, it happens in real life. Why does one do studies?

I think studies are a bunch of BS. Give me Anecdotes any time!

Accuracy is achieved when a plurality of opinions falls on the same curve as the median trajectory of lemmings . . .

One has to use others knowledge and apply to one's own circumstance(s). The "scenario of wedging"; 4 cases of wedging medial heel(s) in 25+ years , all to save fetlocks and pasterns. All but 1 obtain a medial corn per the literature. Paraphrased, "all wedging, toe, heel, medial or lateral will increase medial GFR. Patrick has done some research on the wedge thing almost 20 years later......

I thought Patrick's measurements showed the center of GRF moved laterally when wedging both heels equally? No?

There in lies the knowledge "Of others". Thus 20 years ago versus recent data.......applicable to empirical experiences

Jack

I'd love to sit down for the show, but I think it's just another repeat, yes?

Well Jack, I'm not really one for slagging off other farriers and I'll listen to any reasonable opinion.

But I reckon Pat has earned the right to have a say here, based on his position and experiences. I'll certainly keep an open mind.